jhkimrpg ([info]jhkimrpg) wrote,
@ 2006-02-03 14:45:00
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Entry tags:feminism

Evolutionary Stupidity...
WTF?!?

So via [info]feminist_gamers, I found an old Escapist article "Women in Games" by Chris Crawford (from last November). His article is an analysis of what women want in their games, and he decides to use evolutionary psychology. I am dumbfounded... Words do not express... Well, just read:

In spelling, arithmetic, cooking or any of a thousand other skills, women and men are closely matched, but when it comes to social reasoning, the advantage women enjoy is greater than any other advantage they possess. Thus, women are highly motivated to exercise and develop their social reasoning skills.

We should therefore expect that modern women might well want to exploit this talent in their entertainment. And in fact that turns out to be the case. The classic female mass entertainments are the soap opera and the bodice-ripper.
...
All this leads to a suggestion for what might work for women in games: social reasoning. The ideal game for women, according to this simplified model, would be some sort of interactive soap opera or bodice ripper, presenting the player with complex social problems as she seeks the ideal mate. Contrast this with the kind of software currently being offered to women and you can see why so little progress has been made with this group.
I think stupidities here are pretty fucking obvious, but let me rip into his logic for a bit.

1) The problem he addresses is largely false. Women do play computer games in large quantities -- perhaps under 50%, but over 40%. The latest data is BBC Report on UK gamers, but that confirms other findings such as the Interactive Digital Software Association surveys.

2) Evolutionary psychology is a particularly stupid field for his purposes. If you want to market computer games to women, you should take modern culture into account rather than trying to design games to appeal to the innate genetics of paleolithic gatherers. In other words, use real psychology. There is no need to delve into what is genetically essential versus culturally-determined, and doing so simply muddles the point. I might suggest he look at real modern data, as well as actually talking to some women who aren't grunting and gathering nuts while they nurse their babies.

3) The evolutionary logic for Crawford's claims is extremely thin. Like many, he postulates that men's brains are evolved as hunters while women's are evolved as mothers and gatherers. However, hominids in general are not evolved as hunters. We are primarily gatherers. Hunting for our branch came late in the game, well after our development of tool use. Homo Habilis did not hunt at all -- they used tools for digging, gathering, and hacking at carrion. So it is only for a period between Paleolithic and Neolithic that hunting is an important issue at all. While there was some evolution during that time, the division not nearly as primal as he makes it out to be.

Even after the advent of hunting, hunted meat is not generally the dominant food source. Estimates of meat in the paleolithic diet vary from 35% to 65% -- but that is including more gathered sources such as fishing as well as hunted meat. Say I put it at roughly 50%. This means that gatherers are just as much the providers as hunters. Note that the size ratio of males to females decreases with the evolution from the earlier australopithecines and Homo Habilis to meat-eating Homo Erectus and Homo Sapiens. That is, men and women became more alike in size as we shifted to meat-eating. So rather than increasing the difference between the sexes, the shift to hunting appears to have made them more similar.

In short, I think his picture of evolution owes more to Fred Flintstone than real anthropology. Now, I'm willing to buy some issues of evolutionary psychology. Evolutionarily, females have a high investment for reproduction -- this is true across nearly all mammals. So male reproduction is limited more by their access to fertile females, whereas female reproduction is limited more by access to the resources to nourish their offspring. Testosterone levels do seem to correspond to greater muscle, aggressiveness, and violence. However, his claims about hunting and first-person shooters are based on preconceptions and vague rambling rather than reality.

4) Even given the evolutionary claims, the jump he makes to bodice-rippers and soap operas is ridiculous. Both men and women are social animals and depend strongly on developed relationships. What's interesting to me is that absent his moronic preconceptions, actual evolutionary logic makes one good prediction here. If we accept that post-Homo-Erectus, males have developed as hunters and women as gatherers -- then the obvious idea for women is to make a gathering game. And indeed, last time I was over at a friend's house, I found both her daughters competing away at playing Katamari, a gathering game that is now enormously popular.

5) The proposed solution assumes it as if marketing to women requires a fundamental shift in game play and activities. This is largely ignoring an elephant in the room. If you want adventure computer games that appeal to women, then don't design them with only a handful the female characters, all of whom are heaving-bosomed and bikini-clad. I don't play computer games much, but whenever I look at it, I find them filled with culturally-male content. It doesn't surprise me much that women don't go for that.


Argh. Next up, the less over-the-top stupid but still frustrating article from the most recent issue of the Escapist, Chris Dahlen's "I enjoy playing a Girl".


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[info]brand_of_amber
2006-02-03 11:41 pm UTC (link)
John, I do not think that #5 actually exists anymore.

Really, I don't. Look at the high-quality female-inclusive adds we now have to draw the empowered woman to the gaming table:

We are Progressive!

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[info]brand_of_amber
2006-02-04 02:11 am UTC (link)
P.S. The above is thanks to this post by Nicchick: http://iamnikchick.livejournal.com/97591.html -- some of the others are even worse.

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[info]zdashamber
2006-02-04 12:36 am UTC (link)
Addendum to 4: soap operas are in no way a female thing in most of the world. I took a class on Central Asian Nomads while at Berkeley where the professor spoke of how the entire country of Kazakstan practically shut down during the hour in the afternoon every week (day?) that the most popular Mexican Telenovela was showing.

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[info]heron61
2006-02-04 12:48 am UTC (link)
I have yet to see any piece of academic or non-academic writing about gender that uses evolutionary psychology as evidence that wasn't both essentially propaganda stating that modern western gender roles are fixed, immutable, and eternal. Moreover, the entire field of evolutionary psychology seems to be riddled with this sort of nonsense about race, gender, sexual preference... From my PoV, it's all a bunch of modern just-so stories with about as much validity as intelligent design.

OTOH, I have an MA in cultural anthro, and like almost every other serious student of cultural anthro, I'm prone to going on anti-evolutionary psychology rants at the drop of a hat.

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[info]clehrich
2006-02-06 03:38 am UTC (link)
I recently read a very brilliant and nasty article by Claude Levi-Strauss, in _The View From Afar_, in which he basically points out that the overwhelming majority of evolutionary psychology is based on a series of logical fallacies. It may be true that you're leaning on cultural anthro, but on the other hand you're leaning on something solid. I always start gritting my teeth when idiots start into the whole "well, evolutionarily, you see..." nonsense.

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[info]bethysphere
2006-02-04 12:53 am UTC (link)
Bravo!

A lot of the points you made are points my brain would have come up with eventually, once the seething hatred ceased.

BETH SMASH

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[info]spaceanddeath
2006-02-04 02:33 am UTC (link)
It was this same way in Brazil when I lived there. In the midst of a very popular telenovela, you'd be hard up to get much more service than snagging a caipirinha at a bar during the commercials, and only if you were willing to talk about the show. For the most popular telenovela that Brazil ever had - Roque Santiero in the 80's - it was not at all unusual for the ratings to reach 100%. That's not just gender equality in entertainment appeal, right there. It's got equal appeal to the whole damn market.

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[info]chgriffen
2006-02-04 02:44 pm UTC (link)
A lot of people do armchair "science" when they really don't understand it. Regarding evolution, National Geographic had an article on love and sexuality a few weeks ago, and they wrote that some "scientists" believe the female orgasm developed to allow the female to select a suitable male.

I leave it at that; I'm sure anyone who thinks about this can easily spot how this is total nonsense.

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[info]cpxbrex
2006-02-04 04:53 pm UTC (link)
Well, are you saying that the folks down at National Geographic have a lesser understanding of evolutionary theory than you?

I say this not to say that they're right, but to say that the real damage here is coming from people who ought to know better! Evolutionary psychology, which is just Herbert Spencer revived in updated language, and which is nothing but a justification for the status quo and ignores the self-organizing nature of human consciousness (an interesting comparison is between evolutionary psychology and neurolinguistics), has been floating around science for a long time. Kept alive, alas, by scientists.

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[info]chgriffen
2006-02-04 08:34 pm UTC (link)
Well, are you saying that the folks down at National Geographic have a lesser understanding of evolutionary theory than you?

The woman they quoted certainly appears to have less understanding of evolutionary theory than me, even though (or maybe because) she's an anthropologist. Here's her quote:

"Scientists think the fickle female orgasm may have evolved to help women distinguish Mr. Right from Mr. Wrong." Link.

Nothing evolves in order to do anything or help anyone; that's a fundamental misunderstanding of how evolution works, because it implies a goal that some force is working toward instead of random mutation plus natural selection. She might have just been sloppy in her formulation, but that's a pretty big issue right there, and I don't need to have a degree in evolutionary science to see that.

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[info]jhkimrpg
2006-02-05 05:47 am UTC (link)
I don't think these are comparable. Crawford's whole article was based on a premise that was flawed four times over, not just over evolution, but also the state of the gaming. His whole basis for turning to evolutionary psychology had no reason.

Your complaint about Fisher is picking at a spoken sentence quoted in an interview. It's not even factually incorrect -- it's just ambiguous. Saying "evolved to help" can also mean "has evolved to the point that it helps", though it has other connotations which I agree aren't right. I'm pretty sure that Fisher doesn't actually believe in Intelligent Design or anything, she's just speaking colloquially in an interview. (For that matter, "Mr. Right" isn't exactly a scientific term either. :-) Having interviews for popular magazines is always a bit of a two-edged sword. They always have some degree of errors and/or misperceptions, because they're not a scientific journal and are written to a non-scientific audience. Having worked on several experiments, I know that the explanations about us which appeared in general journalism always had errors. On the other hand, I think it's important for scientists to communicate out to a general audience.

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[info]cpxbrex
2006-02-04 04:48 pm UTC (link)
*snickers* This is one of those situations where if the person had just left out his shoddy gender analysis everything would have been OK. If he'd said, "More games need to use social reasoning" and gave aesthetic reasons for that assertion, I think a bunch of people would be talking about how to make game rules for social reasoning gaming . . . not kind of shaking their heads and going, "Sad."

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(Anonymous)
2006-02-06 12:13 am UTC (link)
Well, if women were really genetically programmed gatherers, D&D would be the role-playing game to attract them (so no innovation required)! I really have to work to get the PCs in the game I GM to interupt their shopping for an adventure...but there's no gender correlation that I've noticed.

Russell



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[info]clehrich
2006-02-06 04:22 am UTC (link)
I posted a long comment on why evolutionary psych is silly on my blog: [info]clehrich. Didn't think it would fit here, in either sense.

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Evolutionary biology
(Anonymous)
2006-02-06 01:37 pm UTC (link)
In addition to various human cultures (the diversity of which is subject to debate), most of the pop evolutionary psych that I've seen fails to account for the wide variety of animal mating behavior and gender distinctions that are presumably all compatible with the same genetic imperatives. Even among primates, an evolutionary account of gender roles has to handle everything from orangutans to bonobos. Even if you could account for all non-human primate behavior, there's a plausible case for human exceptionalism in that (as you point out) culture can trump genetic dispositions, and that the human estrus cycle is very different from most primates.

Also, good evolutionary biology would take into account that genetic optimality is not required by evolution, just genetic viability. There are many species that evolve complex mating behavior basically to distinguish themselves from other species. It is not necessary for these behaviors to further survivability, only that they don't hinder survivability beyond viability.

These are somewhat obvious fallacies, and I've always assumed that ``real'' evolutionary biologists took them into account, but didn't get their cautious quotes into the newspapers.

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(Anonymous)
2006-02-10 03:42 pm UTC (link)
A little while ago the Guardian ran an articel titled "Evolutionary Psychology is just an excuse for old men to lust after young hotties", and I think that pretty much sums it up. I fully agree that I have yet to encounter any occassion in which evolutionary psychology does anything except to reify traditional gender roles.

And the irony is that I think the method is sound. In disagreement with John, I think its quite possible for evolution to have occurred within the time frame he mentions, and that furthermore these might not have gross physiological indicators if they are in fact evolutionary developments of the information system in the brain. It is quite possible that we have hunting reflexes, and I for one think we do. But I certainly DON'T think they are gender specific.

The core idea of trying to find out what our systems are adapted to do, and therefore what is socially and physically plausible, is prima facie reasonable. But the concept has been captured and enslaved to an ideological purpose.

- CC

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[info]jhkimrpg
2006-02-10 05:24 pm UTC (link)
I didn't say that no evolution has happened post-Homo-Erectus. I'm just saying that it's a relatively short time span evolutionarily. For comparison, we can look at how well our teeth are adapted to meat-eating, which we've been doing for longer than we've been hunting. Does neurology evolve faster than teeth? I don't know, but the evolutionary psychology people don't even seem to bring up the question.

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